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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  September 5, 2014 5:00pm-6:01pm PDT

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a popular holiday in this country not just for irish and now can be celebrated fully in a country where people do at their best treat each of us as god's true children. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. tonight, we are "all in." abrupt landing. a chartered plane with as many as 100 americans on board grounded in iran. we'll have the latest details. you can't contain an organization that is running roughshod through that much territory. >> the president says the u.s. and its allies are preparing to take the fight to isis, while republican hawks take a victory lap. and tesla hits the jackpot. state of nevada offers the electric car company over $1 billion in tax breaks to build a battery factory. even if the factory succeeds, will state taxpayers lose? >> i think people in nevada should be very proud that that's
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the state you have. >> "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. breaking news tonight. 100 americans have now left iran hours after the charter plane carrying them from afghanistan to dubai was ordered to land when it crossed into iranian airspa airspace. the fly dubai flight which often carries u.s. contractors from bagram airfield in afghanistan to dubai failed to refile a flight plan after it delayed departure from bagram. ground patrol told the plane to land at an airport, or iranian fighter jets could be scrambled. pilot voluntarily landed before that happened, thank goodness. fly dubai sent a second plane and transloaded the passengers and baggage on to the new plane. it took off to dubai within the last two hours. u.s. officials tell nbc news it was resolved tippett ical ed di. joining me now, nbc news contributor, journalist, expert on iranian affairs.
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good to have you here. >> good to see you. >> i guess the reason everybody gets panicked about this when it first crossed the wires is obviously the president of american hostages in iran in 7 1979, but this is an incredibly dle cat moment between the two countries talk to each other. when something like this happens, you worry that this can escalate. >> well, yeah. i think it's just too juicy of a headline. 100 americans stuck in iran. >> that's exactly right. >> then the idea that planes are going back and forth between kabul or bagram air force base in dubai where transfer to other flights go across the world, and they have to cross over iranian airspace. clearly this is happening all the time. >> yes, right. >> has been since 2002. the iranians have been -- it's clearly in their national interest. it always has been for afghanistan to be stable and for the taliban not to return. the taliban was as big an enemy of iran, maybe even bigger than it was of the united states. not to go too deep into history,
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the iranians helped or offered to help. >> in the early parts of the afghanistan war. >> absolutely. even in getting hamid karzai to become president because iran and the u.s. wanted that to happen and there was this infighting inside afghanistan. there was a lot of coordination with iran, between iran and u.s. at the time and of course we know what happened. george bush, state of the union address where he said iran was evil and that upset further cooperation with iran and sup set many other things like the nuclear negotiations. right now we're at a very sensitive moment between iran and the u.s. both sides really want this nuclear deal which has a deadline of november 24th, three months away. there's going to be notions in here in new york in a couple of weeks. over the nuclear issue. which is a big deal for both countries. there's isis. >> yes. and both sides now, talk about the taliban, there was this great reporting about how the u.s. had special forces who were straight-up coordinating with iranian intelligence. >> yes. >> in the early days of the
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afghan war because the iranians despise the taliban, feared the taliban, wanted to see the taliban. isis is now the kind of most recent iteration -- >> iteration of the taliban. exactly. >> these are people that are coming into towns and executing every shia muslim they find. >> yeah. as a matter of course, right? >> absolutely. what we're seeing is this massively brutal violent sectarian agenda that, of course, iran, is quite opposed to. >> apart from it being sectarian, they're opposed to iraq breaks up into a kurdistan. >> particularly when the government of nuri al maliki is essentially an ally. >> well, and the new government will be, too. iran, again, did coordinate, i think probably if not officially, unofficially in the united states in getting nuri al maliki to resign which was a big problem, as you know, a few weeks ago, or actually to step down from being the premier. iran and the u.s. backed the new premier. here we have, again, interests that are colliding. iran and the u.s. both want a stable iraq. the u.s. does not want to put
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boots on the ground. iran has that cliche of boots on the ground. iran has boots on the ground. the commander of the force you just mentioned, the big piece in the "new yorker" on him, there's a photograph of him in amerli. >> that was referenced in the most recent hostage video. >> exactly. there's a photograph of him there on an iranian website. not just on, you know, not a fake photo as far as we know. so he's there on the ground. and we're bombing. so i doubt if we are bombing his positions, because he's working with the kurds and with the shiites. >> it is such a crazy situation to manage rigimagine right now. >> it is. >> some levels, when you move, you know, 50, 60 kilometers in one direction and you move into syria where the iranian government is alive with assad, again against isis, but sort of against the u.s. or fsa. >> against everyone who wants to overthrow. >> right. you have this tremendously tangled contentious, dangerous part of the world in which you
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have these two powers. these historical enemies who find themselves aligned in certain ways. >> yes. and let's not forget about turkey and saudi arabia here as well. saudi arabia in particular because of the funding they can provide and qatar as well. the funding they can provide to groups such as isis. saudi arabia denies they're funding isis, but there certainly has been money flowing to a group such as isis or isis itself inside syria or iraq. fundamentally for the united states, our interests right now are aligned with iran's interests in the middle east, empb when it comes to assad. >> i would say that the -- there are many people in the israeli government who would beg to differ, to put that -- michael orrin recently said the lesser of two evils was isis over iran. he said that in denver in, in colorado recently. >> that would be shocking. if they were the lesser -- >> i'm just saying. there are some who make that argument. always great to have you. >> thank you. all right. news of the plane stranded in iran broke today just hours after news that another plane, this one carrying americans, a
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private turbo prop plane, had stopped responding to air traffic control. ari glazer, real estate developer from rochester, new york, and wife, jane, left rochester in a brand new seven engine prop plane at 8:25 eastern time this morning heading for naples, florida, just over an hour and a half laser, veteran pilot contacted atlanta air traffic control to report a problem on board. >> we need to descend down to about 180. we have an indication that is not correct on the plane. >> standby. >> descend and maintain level, 250. >> 250. we need to get lower. >> working on that. >> once the plane descended 25,000 feet, communications were stopped, f-15 jets were scrambled to intercept the plane. relatively rare move. when they caught up with the flight, the pilot was slumped over, the windows were frosted. >> i can see the chest rising and falling. right before i left, it was the first time we could see that he was actually breathing. and defending on how fast they
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descend, he may regain consciousness once the aircraft starts descending for fuel starvation. >> f-15 jets had to break off the chase when the plane reached cuban airspace then 14 miles from the jamaican coast the plane went down in the ocean. jamaican officials say they have found a wreckage field in that vicinity and dive teams are heading out to search the area. tonight, a leading theory is the cabin lost pressure and the glaze gla glazers were incapacitated due to lack of oxygen. bob, what are we seeing in the payne/stewart flight comes to mind here. >> that's so similar, back in 1999. i remember we were on the air all day that day, for four hours while the plane flew on kind of ghostlike and in that case, they also scrambled fighter jets up and they looked at the plane. they could see the windows were
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frosted over indicating it was very cold inside which is a sure sign of lack of oxygen. oxygen depravation. they could see, again, in that case, the pilot slumped over the controls. so this came down very, very much like that. you can't tell what it is that caused that oxygen depravation in the plane. you know, could it have been a seal somewhere on the plane? something wrong with the air circulation system? the air comes in, bleed air off the engines, to keep the oxygen supply replenished inside. so things can go wrong with that. we just don't know yet. >> what happens when a plane becomes depressurized? >> well, the oxygen leaves so the pilot -- if the pilot realizes what's happening in time, there's supplemental oxygen on most planes and there surely was on this one, so if the pilot is able to realize what's going on and react, he could grab the oxygen mask and
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take in the supplemental oxygen. you can't tell from that little radio transmission that we heard where the pilot has radioed in that he's got a problem. we don't know whether he knew it was a problem with the pressurization system. could be, you know, something else is going on with the plane. we just don't know. so, don't know if he had any time to try to get the oxygen mask, but evidently, in the end did not, because everything else on the way that flight traveled out there in a straight line and everything indicates that both the pilot and his wife were unconscious, if not dead already. >> over the course of your career of covering aviation, there was tremendous strides made in the safety of commercial aviation. we're talking about big commercial carriers. you know, record low number of fatalities in the u.s. domestic flights for a number of years. it doesn't seem like that same kind of safety revolution has happened with smaller planes or am i wrong and we just sort of pay attention when they go down?
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>> no, i think that the record has improved a lot with the small planes as well. i mean, to have moved forward sort of in tandem. and you're right, there's a tremendous difference. when i first started reporting aviation, this is about 35 years ago, something like that, there was a big commercial crash at least once, if not twice a year in the u.s. and now, i mean, it's just such a rare thing. so, on both the private planes and the big jets, the safety record has improved remarkably. >> yet, these do go down relatively often, or go down more often than commercial jetliners. is that just due to the wider spectrum of pilot ability? these are less redundant mach e machines than massive big corporate jetliners? >> it's both of those, but in particular, what you mentioned about the pilots, i mean, the commercial pilots are so highly trained and they're in the simulators and they're constantly presented with these
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different accident scenarios and react to them in the simulator, it's just like flying the plane. private pilots, they also get simulator training if they want it, but it's nothing like what the commercial pilots get. so, yeah, that is one difference is the pilot training. >> obviously sort of horrible tragedy for the glazers and everyone in their family. robert hager, thank you very much. appreciate it. >> thank you, chris, yes. after being accused of not having a plan to deal with isis, president obama announced today he has a plan, sort of. that's ahead. help make secure l tomorrows a reality for over 19 million people. [ alex ] transamerica helped provide a lifetime of retirement income. so i can focus on what matters most. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. transamerica. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. whenwork with equity experts who work with regional experts that's when expertise happens. mfs. because there is no expertise without collaboration.
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after almost five months of direct conflict, there's a cease-fire in eastern ukraine. russia has been at pains to say it's not part of the conflict, today's deal was signed by representatives of ukraine, rebels, organization for security and cooperation of europe, and the russian ambassador who called it a breakthrough. ukrainian president petro
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join the nation. ♪ nationwide is on your side today, president obama announced newly created tole list against isis with a goal apparently far broader than the initial u.s. effort to contain and beat back isis in iraq. the goal now, to degrade and destroy isis. >> i also leave here confident that nato allies and partners are prepared to join in a broad international effort to combat the threat posed by isil. secretary kerry will now travel to the region to continue building the broad-based coalition that will enable us to
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degrade and ult pimately destro isil. you can't contain an organization that is running roughshod through that much territory causing that much havoc, displacing that many people, killing that many innocents. >> coming at the end of the nato summit in wales, the core coalition of ten countries including canada, britain, france, germany, italy, denmark, australia, includes one muslim nation, turkey. isis is the rare regional actor without known state sponsors. secretary john kerry's plans to go to the middle l east is designed to build on informal support the u.s. has already received in its effort against isis including from so-called moderate arab states like united arab emirates and saudi arabia. u.s. ally and possible partner against isis saudi arabia beheaded 19 people this month including one for sorcery, according to multiple reports. the beginning of a meeting with defense secretary chuck hagel
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and the foreign and defense ministers of other nato nations, secretary kerry said there's no contained policy for isil. there's a genocidal, quasi state within a regular army and leaving them in some capacity, intact, anywhere, will leave a cancer in place that will ultimately come back to haunt us. the plan, however, is still being formed. a diplomat told "the new york times," it indicated the u.s. was still fleshing out its strategy against the militant group, isis. as the consensus both internationally and domestically seems to be moving toward military escalation against isis, senator john mccain took a victory lap tweeting out it's gratifying to see doves turn into hawks. mccain links to a piece from his own party. rand paul, solid opponent of intervention, appears to be twisting himself into knots suggesting the u.s. should align with bashar al assad in iran. all indications is president obama could get some kind of authorization from congress in
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its very abbreviated september session. the president did not indicate today the u.s. offensive gaeagat isis, what has yet involved air strikes in syria. joining me, jacob sullum at "reason" magazine. it did seem to me we were really in an anti-interventionist moment just a year ago when syria was -- the idea of bombing syria was floated and there was just a broad cross-ideological bipartisan uprising against that idea and it seems like things are different right now. >> well, i mean, rand paul was in an anti-interventionist mood as recently as last friday. he was here in dallas. he was asked about isis, and he did not say they'd pose a threat to our national security that we need to address. did not say we should wage war against them. he said we need to have a debate about that and indicated it wasn't clear to him that isis, did, in fact, pose a threat to u.s. security. that justified war. and just a few hours after that,
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he was telling "ap" if he were president, he would convene congress and ask them to authorize war to completely destroy isis. something happened there to change his mind on this. >> what is your understanding on that? to me, paul seems a likely 2016 candidate. he has a foreign policy that is probably between his father's, ron paul, and john mccain's, but closer to his father's. will the republican donor class and the base stomach those kind of foreign policy views? >> yeah, he's been tarred as an isolationist by democrats as well as republicans for a long time. unfairly, i think. basically, he's expecting, you know, skepticism about foreign intervention. he's being cautious. he's not saying he never wants to intervene. i think he's tired of that and wants to show he is willing to intervene and this is, you know, an opportunity to do that. to show he's not an isolationist. it's unfortunate. it surprised me, embarrassed me, too.
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i had just written a column praising him for being cautious about intervention. it seems to me this is a political move on his part to try to position himself in terms of the republican, you know, nomination race, and to fend off criticism from both parties. i don't know whether he really means it or not, but if so, he's convinced himself of it pretty quickly. >> it seems to me that part of what's happening here is there's an effectiveness to the gruesomeness of the isis prop began propaganda. they are releasing videos that make you despise them and make you want to see terrible things happen to them because they're doing horrible things to americans in a horrible way and that is having this kind of intended effect in that it's producing the kind of political coalition and consensus and groundwork for intervention that we are now seeing falling into place. >> yes, that's clearly rand paul's reacting to that. if you look at his statements about this, he says we can't let them do that, we can't let them behead american journalists. we have to protect our embassy.
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now, that's disturbing to me because there are americans in virtually every country on earth. we have a diplomatic presence in almost every country on earth. and that's a pretty dangerous, dangerously open-ended justification for military intervention if you're going to say that wherever americans are threatened, we may intervene. that's exactly the opposite of the approach that rand paul was calling for last week, you know, when he wrote in the "wall street journal" about how intervening in syria against assad was a mistake, that it actually had strengthened isis. he also criticized interventions in libya and iraq, i think rightly so. it seems to me he is, along with everyone else, is reacting emotionally and saying this is horrible, we have to do something about it, but if you really are cautious and skeptical about foreign intervention, you have to pause and take a breath and say, is this really the sort of threat to national security that justifies war? >> and that is what is going to be interesting to me about the debate that's going to happen when congress comes back. it does look, i mean, bill
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nelson obviously is going to be introducing a resolution. there's a far broader one introduced in the house by frank wolf of virginia. there's going to be a debate. members of congress have to line up, get up and say where they are. my sense is the combination of those videos and a midterm election, you know, a few weeks away, is going to lead to a stampede toward granting authorization. >> that may be what happens. to his credit, at least paul is calling for a congressional vote. you know, it happens to be what the constitution requires. and it requires it for good reason. you know, i think a lot of members of congress we just assume not have to sign off on it and not be responsible for it, but they should be. there should be a debate and people should lay out arguments. this is why this is the sort of threat that justifies war. ais i'm not on vinconvinced. apparently rand paul is. they need to have the debate so the american public understands what's going on and what justification for intervention is. >> jacob sullum, thanks so much. >> thank you.
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after michael brown was shot by police, the police released a surveillance video that showed him appearing to forcibly take a box of cigars from a convenience store. many people saw that as an act of character assassination. the police justification was that they had no choice, the media asked for it. did the media ask for it? tonight we have an answer. that's next. and startup ny companies will be investing hundreds of millions of dollars in jobs and infrastructure. thanks to startup ny, businesses can operate tax free for 10 years. no property tax. no business tax. and no sales tax. which means more growth for your business, and more jobs. it's not just business as usual. see how new york can help your business grow, at startup.ny.gov
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today, new developments surrounding one of the most controversial episodes in the aftermath of the death of michael brown. the surveillance video released by police in the week following
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the death of michael brown showing brown in a convenience store appearing to forcibly take a box of cigars. that surveillance video was widely seen in the ferguson community as a way to assassinate the character of the dead teen. but on the day police released the video, ferguson police chief tom jackson vigorously defended his decision. >> we have a lot of freedom of information requests for this tape. and at some point, it was just determined we had to release it. we didn't have good cause absent any other reason to not release it under the foi. >> we got a lot of freedom of information requests for this tape. a lot for this tape. jackson then went on to say, again, then one more time for good measure, police released a tape because the press was asking for it. >> what i did was release the vid videotape to you because i had to. i've been sitting on it, but i -- too many people put in foi
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requests for that thing and i had to release that tape to you. >> if the murderer -- the murder and the robbery did not come together, why did the video come out and it was not related together? >> because the press asked for it. >> key point there, that the murder -- well, the death of michael brown, was killing of michael brown, was not related to the robbery, something the chief would later confirm. now, today, new documents are calling the chief's version of events into question. matthew keys, the blot.com, s submitted his own freedom of information request asking formal all requests from news organizations specifically asking for the video of the convenience store robbery. pu there weren't a lot. according to the logs, not one single journalist asked specifically for the tape. he reports one request seemed broadly worded enough it could have possibly been read to have included the tape of the robbery. on september 12th, a request
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asking for, "all documentation, the events leading up to including the shooting of michael brown, could include, but may not be limited to incident arrests, investigation reports, 911 audio, photos and video obtained by the police department. q" ""he would have submitted a similarly broad request had he not. and it is important to know that he asked for a lot of other information from police as well, both the incident report and the 911 calls were asked for multiple times by several different outlines. police as of today have chosen not to release the incident report with darren wilson's version of events or any 911 calls. but the apparent effort to spin a tale of a thuggish michael brown and an embattled officer, darren wilson, extends far beyond the ferguson police department. a right wing blogger today posted pictures he says are from michael brown's instagram. they look pretty much like what you'd expect from an 18-year-old male. the blogger writes that they
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reveal, quote, a misogynistic young man obsessed with drugs, money and violence. meanwhile, this image has been making its way around facebook and the internet, attached to messages like, "officer wilson arrested after that poor little gentle brown got done with him." "why isn't the mainstream media releasing photos of police officer darren wilson's injuries after he was assaulted?" it purports to be police officer darren wilson after the incident that left brown dead but it is not wilson, i repeat. it is not wilson. it's twhalmotocross athlete mcn after an accident. an untold number of people, including possible jurors against darren wilson, are seeing that face in their feed and think that picture is a true story of what happened. (vo) ours is a world of passengers. the red-eyes.
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of the city of reno. supporters say the massive factory, part of tesla's long-term strategy to drive down the cost of its electric cars will create 6,500 manufacturing jobs and thousands more construction and indirect jobs. >> this giga factory will mean nearly $100 billion in economic impact to nevada over the next 20 years. think about that. >> economic benefit to the state, whatever it turns out to be, comes at a serious price. tesla pitted five states against each other in a kind of bidding auction for the facility. essentially running an auction to see who could make the best offer. in june, texas governor rick perry, whose state is famous for throwing incentive packages to companies, test drove a tesla of part of his effort to bring the facility to his state. >> you know what, i think what would make it even prettier is if it had a made in texas bumper sticker on it. >> so what did it take for nevada to win the factory? well, the state legislature
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approves the deal, nevada will new york ov fork over $1.25 billion in tax breaks over two decades and tesla would pay no sales tax for 20 years or property tax and payroll tax for ten years. the company would get transferable tax credits which allow businesses to sell tax credits to otherically a check million. tesla would operate tax free for a decade. an open letter for the announcement, good jobs first and other groups warn the deal may be part of an ongoing race to the bottom between states with no real winner. sandoval said the return on investment will be 80 to 1. >> even the most skeptical economists would conclude that this is a strong return for us. >> joining me now, political reporter john ralston, host of "ralston reports." all right, good deal? is it being hailed as a good deal in nevada? >> if you don't hail it as a
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good deal, i think your label is -- it was really something else to be at this event yesterday in front of the capital. there are hundreds of people there. they had no idea the details you just mentioned there. they came out right before sandoval and musk made the announcement. they're jumping to their feet in standing ovations. must have been close to a half dozen of them. as if they were seeing the rolling stones in 1969 or something like that. they were treated really like rock stars, sandoval and musk. let's face it, there's a certain underdog mentality in nevada. we're up against texas and california. look. we landed this. we got this big giga factory. we should be celebrating. >> of course, this is the kind of thing every politician -- a kind of event every politician salivates over, right? it's a new factory. it's a bunch of jobs. it looks like it's going to be decent paying job, $25 an hour. it's a cutting edge company that's growing. just hit an all-time stock price. there is something profoundly
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perverse about running essentially an auction between five different states to see how much money they can throw at you and, you know, $1.25 billion, this is in the now top ten of all-time tax incentive deals in the entire country. the top being boeing got $8.7 billion from washington. so you wonder, like, is there going to be buyers remorse if this doesn't work out the way that the governor promised it would? >> well, listen, you can't blame musk at all. me played all the states. as you said. and what's interesting about nevada, there's a lot of people, smart people, chris, who think that nevada was going to get this all along. we're the only state that has an active lithium mine. nevada was willing to do things no other state was willing to do. we didn't give them the best incentive package. in fact, at one point, he was asking, i understand, musk for $500 million in cash upfront. i guess sandoval said no to that because that's -- >> just think about that for a second. think about that for a second.
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america, land of free market capitalism, up by your bootstraps. think about how bizarre and inverted this is. this entire process. >> well, of course it is. and, of course, you will hear people argue, listen, the incentives are worth it because we're not really giving them all those tax breaks because there will be no tax to abate if they were not here. but listen, i live here. i've lived here for almost 30 years, chris. this is a state that dramatically underfunds education. doesn't pay enough attention to social services. doesn't fund infrastructure properly. i think people would like to see people giving standing ovations when they announce some visionary plan to take care of those needs. that's the issue for a lot of people. this could end up being the economic boone that the governor says. there's a couple other components to this, real quickly. >> yeah. >> the renewable energy component, and harry reid has talked about this. you know, musk is obviously a big renewable guy. we are a huge place for renewables here, yet alone, nevada, highest geothermal
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percentage in the country. i think that is a very, very significant aspect of this. we also have something no other state has which is interesting here. they're going to talk about this at the special session next week. we have performance-based incentive plans. they have to do certain things to get any of this money, and the speaker of the assembly -- >> huh, interesting. >> -- who's a democrat, very outspoken about such things is going to insist that those performance-based benchmarks be placed right in the bill that is going to be written for tesla. >> i see. so the idea being that the money and the tax credits and the packages that have been put together will be contingent on some benchmarks so you don't have a situation in which they decide, oh turns out we actually only need 1,000 people to run this factory. we'll still take the $1.2 billion. >> right. exactly. john ralston, thanks a lot. >> you bet. we all think we are done with segregation in this country, but maybe it just looks different. two glaring examples, ahead. work with equity experts
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find new ways to save energy and money with pg&e's business energy check-up. "the new york times" this week, historian heather cox richardson called for the gop to bring back the party of lincoln. writing "abraham linkcoln and others recoil from the idea of government as a prop for the rich. warned that a healthy economy depended on widespread prosperity." as pointed out in yt new york" magazine, it's not likely the republican party can return to the ideals of lincoln considering, "alliance between the white south and republican party has grown more firm than ever." as for ef denvidence as to why s the case, look at south carolina where there's a race going on for the open lieutenant governor state between democrat sellers, according to south carolina state newspaper, could become the first african-american elected to that post since reconstruction. his opponent, henry mcmaster, former u.s. attorney and south carolina attorney general.
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sellers challenged mcmaster yesterday to, "perm feianently renounce his membership from a historically all white country club." mcmaster has no plans to resign from the club where he's been a member for more than 30 years. now that the club has no policies of racial discrimination, and mcmaster would not be a member if it did. joining me, mr. sellers. mr. sellers, as i understand this, this is a club that was once officially an all-white club, is to longer as a matter of policy. so what's wrong with being a member? >> well, for me, and first, thank you for having me, mr. hayes. for me, this is not about the club per se. this is about breaking away from the ghost and the themes of yesterday. moving south carolina forward. i tell people all the time, my race is not about what south carolina was, not about what south carolina is, but what south carolina can be. and i simply asked my opponent to join me in renouncing his membership in a club that currently has no african-american members. it does have some african-americans on a
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quote/unquote waiting list. but to join me in renouncing his membership. let's just go forward. >> but wait a second -- >> i'm not trying to interject race into this. ais i'm trying to move it forward. >> it seems to me history is germane here, what the symbolism of the club means. he was a member there for 30 years, a member there, apparently, according to reporting in a local paper, back in 2008, had a deed that restricted it to whites only membership, that it is about history and it is about race. >> well, you know, mr. hayes, for me, i like to look forward. i like to believe in what abraham lincoln called the better angels of our nature. for me, i'm trying to move south carolina forward. i want to have a community and place where we can talk about how we improve and prepare our children for 21st century global economy and improve our crumbling infrastructure. yes, i challenged him to renounce his membership because i want people to look at south
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carolina and see that we're elevating our discussion. that we're raising the stature of our state, no longer have to be held back by those ghosts of yesterday. >> do you think the politics in south carolina have changed considerab considerably? it seems to me there's been a tremendous change in north carolina. north carolina is a very different state for a whole bunch of historical reasons. in terms of what its big cash crop was and also what it's been recently in terms of an influx from the north. are the politics in south carolina changing, too? >> i believe so. i mean, look mr. hayes, i'm 29 years old. i've been elected for eight years. i'm running for rulieutenant governor because i believe this is a great state. i've been traveling the state the last 14 months shakes hands and asking people for votes. i really believe on november 4th we can make history. i'm sorry i believe in words like hope, truth, love, justice, and peace. i believe south carolina believes if those words, too. i hope that carries me over the finish line. >> i think everyone believes in those words, mr. sellers. >> i hope so. and i believe that -- i believe
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that those beliefs will carry me over the finish line. i'm excited about where we are, and i know this is going to be an uphill battle. it's a david versus goliath journey. we know that. >> let me ask you this. the club in question, forest lake club, am i right one of the managing partners at your law firm is a member? >> correct. >> have you told him he should quit? >> well, as we illustrated in the article and everyone who asked, i said, hooefre's not ru for lieutenant governor. i tried to take a step back and say this is not about the club per se but about everything that symbolizes. it's about those ghosts that have really just binded our state. this is about trying to break free of those shackles and have a conversation about the future of south carolina. i love my boss to death. we have conversations all the time. he's not running for lieutenant governor. if he was, we would be having similar discussions today. >> 29 years old. why did you decide to run for lieutenant governor now? >> i think we have an awesome opportunity. i mean, like, as i said, i've been in the general assembly for
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the past eight years and south carolina has not been moving forward even slowly but has been stagnant. we have hospitals that are closing down, children who are dying and the department of social services, if somebody doesn't stand up and scream from the mountaintops that it's time for a change, if not me, then who? if not now, then when? >> bakari sellers. thank you very much. >> thank you. what happens jo s when you have any diversity? next. ♪
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the agust economist magazine, a weekly british institution of intellect and class has apologized today for a book review it ran that, well, if it wasn't exactly a pro slavery book review, it was kind of an anti-anti-slavery book review. the review in its layest issue, the forthcoming book "the half has never been told: slavery and the making of american capitalism" read, and i quote, "mr. baptist has not written an objective slavery of history. almost all the blacks in the book are victims, almost all the whites villains. this is not history but advoca y advocacy." criticizing the author for lack of balance about slavery. the original review has been taken down and replaced with an apology which reads in part "we regret having published this and apologize for having done so." this is the kind of thing that happens and major obstacle of having an intelligent conversation about race which have having that conversation
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with people who aren't white. joining me now, jalani cobb, contributor to "new yorker" and associate professor of history, director of the institute for african-american studies at university of connecticut, and jay smooth, video director at eldoctrine.com. you should check it out if you have not. this only, like, and we were looking at the editors at the "economist" who as far as we can tell appear to be all white. they might not be. i don't know. just how did this get through? and this is such an old idea. i mean, this is like an idea from back in reconstruction days in the first historeographical. >> the history of slavery and the reconstruction and so on and what exactly it meant. so, it's sad to see this, but it's not exactly surprising. there is a long historiographic. people describe slavery as an institution in which black
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people largely benefited and white people were largely the stowers of western civilization. that has not entirely died out. we look at now a few months ago in texas they were trying to remove the word slave from slave trade so it would be the tri g triangular trade, people could have been trading tobacco or food stock in opposed to human beings. this is not isolated. may seem egregious, ridiculous, laughable. >> it's also a lesson about what it means to have diversity in the media, i think, which is something that, you know, everyone is talking about a lot. most people fail at. i don't even think we're where we should be. but that's what you get when you don't have that. >> right. i mean, it's the same psychological phenomenon you see with someone justifying being in an all-white club. >> that's right. >> you know, only a bad person would be racist. if i'm a good person, i obtain the status of never having to think about racism and i go through life passively assuming
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i'm not racist, so you let an unjust status quo perpetuate all around you and one of the ways you see this is this bizarre lack of perspective in the "economist" piece. >> i was thinking about segregation, what was fascinating about the all white club segregation story, it's not an all white club by deed anymore. it isn't officially segregated. america is very segregated even if not legally segregated. the public religion research institute, 75% of white americans report the network of people with whom they discuss important matters is entirely white with no minority presence. 65% of black americans report on a social network that is compo e composed entirely of people who are also black. how troubled should we be by the social segregation of america? >> right. so part of this -- this has implications beyond this. we think we say, oh, well, i just happen to not have any black friends, happen to not have any friends of a different ethnic or racial group and happens to be my life. it actually has implications
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beyond this. when people are talking about, who do you hire? this happens all the time. oh, we haven't met any qualified black people. you don't know any black people. >> right. >> and so having that conversation, then it's going to continue to replicate itself in that way. and so just on that level of social networks, the other level of kind of when something like ferguson happens, if you do not have access to a person who can say, no, the way that you may have experienced policing is fundamentally different than the way that people of color experienced policing in this country, you wind up with, you know, what we have here. >> there was a fascinating, the difference between twitter and facebook with mike brown and racially segregated social networks. twitter was mike brown, mike brown. on facebook, it was a.l.s. challenge, ice bucket challenge, ice bucket challenge. it hit home to them the fact there's this kind of divided world in which these two different conversations are happening. >> yeah. i mean, i think that people, white people, some white people,
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because not generalizing about all white people is the most important thing you can do in any race discussion. >> yes. >> we've learned. they have a tendency to assume -- >> they. there comes the they. >> some of they have a tendency to assume that the measure of whether i'm a good legaltarian person is whether i'm past having to be mindful of my connection to history, my place in the world. any racism that i didn't personally create, you're maligning, you're impugning my status as a good person by suggesting i have to be aware of my place in the system and that leads to all sorts of on liblob. you need to be history blind and objective blind. >> romantic connections, friendship connections, is it fair to judge someone for the racial makeup of their social network? >> any other information, no. i mean, i went to a historically black university, and it has function -- i went to howard university. and it functioned then the way these institutions were set up to function which is i've relied
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upon that network throughout my life since then. but it was very clear, like, in the absence of there -- >> i went to a historically white university. >> we also kind of differentiate people who say historically black and hysterically black. you have to create a network of your own that will allow you to kind of move through the world in these ways. >> people talk about the obama coalition, the millennials, rise in a lot of america. i always wonder, like, are we going to see that in the data that the facebook feeds, are we going to see there is going to be more cross pollination at a social level in america going forward. >> i think our natural tendency is to perpetuate the same divides if we're not cautiously actively trying to offset them. i know this from doing a hip hop radio show for 20 years. i don't think as myself as someone who wants to exclude women from the circle. if i'm not cautiously every week saying i need to get female
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voices in, we're going to perpetuaperpe perpetuate the boy's club in the studio. it's not good enough to assume i'm good. you need to practice being good. >> jelani cobb, jay smooth. that is "all in." "the rachel maddow stloe" starts now. good evening, rachel. good evening, chris. thanks to you at home for being with us this hour. something sort of amazing happened today during the president's press conference which he did from wales at the nato summit. it was an amazing thing about the press conference. didn't really have anything to do directly with the president, himself, but it was amazing. watch. >> so, with that, let me take a few questions. i'll start with julie pace of the "associated press." >> thank you, mr. president. i wanted to go back to the situation in ukraine. >> angela king. >> as you know, secretary kerry today. >> julie davis. >> is the goal to ultimately -- secretary kerry said there's no containing that. >> one last question. colleen. colleen nelson of "wall street
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